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SA HELLCAT INITIAL IMPRESSIONS






4x4Brit

Worktruck Driver
#21
Does it bother anyone else that SA makes all their striker guns in Croatia? I find it hard to believe that they couldn't be made in the USA and make a profit.
It’s about the only thing that would stop me buying it. Nothing against Croats and Croatia, but surely they could have manufactured it here and employed Americans?
 

nikk

Member
Forum Supporter
2019 Supporter
#22
Does it bother anyone else that SA makes all their striker guns in Croatia? I find it hard to believe that they couldn't be made in the USA and make a profit.
That does kinda bother me. I mean, it wouldn't stop me from buying one if I liked the gun but still...
Sig makes the P365 in New Hampshire and they seem to be happy with the profit that they make on it.
 

MAC702

LEGEN...wait for it... DARY!
Forum Supporter
Commercial Sponsor
#24
Interesting question as it relates to the Hellcat. Their first real striker-fired lineup, the XD series, was a Croatian design, and sold here as the HS2000. Springfield needed to get into the striker-fired DAO market and instead of designing their own, they just purchased the HS2000 lock, stock, and barrel. They were continued to be made in Croatia by the same people who designed it, and the improvements and other variants have all come from the same place.

Whether or not the Hellcat has any XD blood in it at all, beyond being a polymer frame, I can see it making good sense for it to come from the same polymer-pistol factory where they already have an extremely successful relationship, instead of tooling up completely anew.
 

terdog

uber Member
#25
"making good sense"?

Surely you mean "making good cents", because having to transport your products halfway around the world infers that your only concern is to maximize profit at the expense of everything else.

As pointed out earlier, if Sig can make it here and make a reasonable profit, then why not SA?

Its a polymer. 1 of its strong points is the ease of manufacture. And when you have many other polymer units in your lineup, you can amortize tooling/production costs.

ALL of SA's products should be made here. Especially since SA touts its strong American heritage. Tooling up completely new and making your product here is a viable option when your selling your American roots and America is your biggest market.

Is this not a prime example of the "make America Great Again" philosophy? Its NOT just washing machines and cars.
 

terdog

uber Member
#27
Who are we? Seriously?

"WE" are the ones making that company profitable by buying their products. As far as I'm concerned "we" have as much right to dictate where and what they make and sell. They are in existence to please us. If we are not pleased, then they will shrivel up and die because we will not buy their products.

I prefer to have the products that I spend my money on, money that I made in America from other Americans, made here in my country by God.

And in regards to SA ... remember when they got their pee pee slapped for the actions of the lobbyist? Was that not the consumer telling them how to run their business?
 

JTW_Jr

WheelGunner
#28
Yeah, ok , they are in business to please us ? ROFL. It is a business, they are in a business to make money , period. To think otherwise is kidding yourself. The thing is , neither you nor I get to dictate to somewhere where they make their product.

Apple is a US Company that makes NOTHING in the US. Are the phone consumers supposed to tell them to make them in the US ?

That is not how business works.

If you don't like where a product is made, you don't have to like it or buy it, but to demand or expect them to change where it is made to please a few people that even care, doubtful.

And as far as the lobbyist stuff, that was because they didn't want to soil the brand. Their guns are stilling selling decently, even the (poop) Grip zone guns. :) Companies care about $$. Not likes, not happiness, not making what WE want, money , bottom line. If it is profitable, they make it , if it is not they don't.

Again, look at Apple. They make (poop) the consumer doesnt want, and the dolts complain about it , then line up to buy the newest device, because they have to have the status symbol. :)
 

terdog

uber Member
#30
but to demand or expect them to change where it is made to please a few people that even care, doubtful.
Thats the bottom line. We all make noise about MAGA, but what do you do about it? My safe has 2 out of 16 guns that WERE NOT MADE IN AMERICA.
Its not hard to move their minds and I'm willing to fire the 1st salvo.


And as far as the lobbyist stuff, that was because they didn't want to soil the brand.
They got caught with their hand in the cookie jar. They saw what pissed off customers did to their business and profit line. Sales fell through the floor. The President made a video apology fer cryin out loud.
I forgave them and have bought several of their products, but they learned a lesson and have kept their nose clean since ( as far as we know)




Like Sig, Dan Wesson, LB, Wilson Combat et al.

Your rolling over like a lamb if you think that you as a consumer don't have power. Ford & Chevy dropped models that weren't selling.
 

terdog

uber Member
#31
Kind of like Walmart?
Your off base. I'm referring to a gun maker and we are its target audience.

WallyM is listening to its base consumer. We are just a little bitty thang compared to its everyday joe, as is evidenced by the fact that they have not reversed their new policy.
 

WantaG18

Geisterfahrer
Forum Supporter
2020 Supporter
#32
Thats the bottom line. We all make noise about MAGA, but what do you do about it? My safe has 2 out 16 guns that WERE NOT MADE IN AMERICA.
Its not hard to move their minds and I'm willing to fire the 1st salvo.
When can we expect to see the video of you taking an American made tool and destroying the 2 guns that WERE NOT MADE IN AMERICA?
 

nikk

Member
Forum Supporter
2019 Supporter
#34
Off topic but related... Springfield Armory is an imposture, and a pretender in the worst way. It is not the real, original Springfield Armory. They stole that name. A few years after the genuine Springfield Armory, which was Government owned, closed it's doors, some private individual just ripped off the name and rode their coat-tails. Even worse is that they have the audacity to use a logo with crossed cannons and "since 1794" which is a total and complete LIE. There is no LEGACY about it. If you go on the website today, they have a line -- "Defend Your Legacy" which, IMO, just furthers their culpability.

Quote from Wikipedia:

"Following the closure of the U.S. Army Springfield Armory in 1968, the L .H . Gun Co. of Devine, Texas was renamed "Springfield Armory, Inc" to capitalize on the name recognition. There is no affiliation between the original Springfield Armory and Springfield Armory, Inc. The name is not licensed from one organization to another, despite Springfield Armory, Inc marketing that suggests official use. The company's main products are M1911 pistols, and the M1A rifle series."

Here is the logo (or trademark) that SA uses today... ironically, it should say "since 1974". Maybe it was a misprint.




terdog... sorry for my rant. I should have started my own thread for that.

My apology.
 
Last edited:

MAC702

LEGEN...wait for it... DARY!
Forum Supporter
Commercial Sponsor
#35
I can't fault that rant. I learned early on about the name recognition gimmick, and in some forums we always refer to them as SAI, to distinguish them from SA, because, for example, BOTH of them made M1 and M14 type rifles. Some credit SAI for being pretty smart and lucky. Very good point you make about the Since 1794, though.

BUT, this is not new. And consumers should be wary of it EVERYWHERE. Armalite and Henry are just two off the top of my head that are completely new companies that purchased a name to go with a completely new company and factory.

Want a Dan Wesson handgun? There is some serious name recognition.
 

titanNV

NRA Endowment Member
Staff member
Administrator
Forum Supporter
#36
That happens with brand names all the time.....

As everyone knows, I'm a huge Springfield fan, from their Brazilian 1911s, to Croation XDs. Heck the M1A is pretty damn cool too. They make decent valued guns for the money.

Flame on, but I prefer shooting XDs over Glocks made in any country! :whistle:
 

terdog

uber Member
#37
Confusing thread is confusing, OP creates a thread to share how much he likes a product that he purchased, then spends the rest of the thread telling everyone why no one should purchase one.
Well sir, maybe you should read my posts again, as I never said that or anything like it.
But don't let the facts get in your way.
 

terdog

uber Member
#39
Off topic but related... Springfield Armory is an imposture, and a pretender in the worst way. It is not the real, original Springfield Armory. They stole that name. A few years after the genuine Springfield Armory, which was Government owned, closed it's doors, some private individual just ripped off the name and rode their coat-tails. Even worse is that they have the audacity to use a logo with crossed cannons and "since 1794" which is a total and complete LIE. There is no LEGACY about it. If you go on the website today, they have a line -- "Defend Your Legacy" which, IMO, just furthers their culpability.

Quote from Wikipedia:

"Following the closure of the U.S. Army Springfield Armory in 1968, the L .H . Gun Co. of Devine, Texas was renamed "Springfield Armory, Inc" to capitalize on the name recognition. There is no affiliation between the original Springfield Armory and Springfield Armory, Inc. The name is not licensed from one organization to another, despite Springfield Armory, Inc marketing that suggests official use. The company's main products are M1911 pistols, and the M1A rifle series."

Here is the logo (or trademark) that SA uses today... ironically, it should say "since 1974". Maybe it was a misprint.




terdog... sorry for my rant. I should have started my own thread for that.

My apology.
Absolutely no need to apologize.
Facts are facts. No rant seen or heard.
 

WantaG18

Geisterfahrer
Forum Supporter
2020 Supporter
#40
You may want to do that, but I never said that should be done.
Then the question is: What are you going to do about the situation?

What salvo are you going to fire? Are you fine with 12.5% of your firearms not being made in America?